Michelle & Marissa (00:01.054)

It's happening. We're back. We didn't even miss. We didn't. That was good. Did you miss us? I hope so. Yeah, we're back after a longer than really planned hiatus. It kind of sucked. I think, well, I mean, to be honest, I was just really burnt the fuck out. And like, I couldn't even think about content for a podcast.

It was like, I couldn't think about content. So if you don't create a content, you may not understand, like, and first of all, create content. If you don't create content, if you don't create podcasts, if you don't create content, I think it can be sometimes easy to not actually see how much work there is. And there's like a lot of executive functioning pieces that go beyond like.

So it's actually like recording the podcast is the easy part. Yeah. And there's nothing that's like really necessarily hard about it. I mean, we're not like a heavily produced podcast or anything, but- Sure we are. I mean, we like record this and then we download it. And then I make sure I put captions on it for YouTube. Then I have to make a cover for YouTube. And then I do the show notes and then like- You do good show notes. I do shit show notes.

It's like you got one sentence, you know? Listen here. You know who uploaded the episode based on the show notes, but it's literally a one sentence synopsis. I just, you know. No spoilers. Overachiever. But there's like, just like a lot of pieces. So like when you listen, I'm not saying this like for you to be like, well, just don't do it if it's so much work, but just to recognize that like creators, even people who are creating things on Instagram, there's usually like.

It's not like a five minute thing to get most of these, especially if they're look good, if they're high quality, if they are, if there is like valuable, like tidbits of information, and it's not just like a cat video of the cat, like being cute, like I sometimes post, but. Raccoons. Raccoons, but you know, so anyways, it's not that the, like I actually have a ton of ideas for content.

But it's just the same way I feel about going to the grocery store. Yeah. It's not, it's not the grocery store that bothers me. It's the, I got to get in the car. It sounds so ridiculous. I got to go to the grocery store. I got to remember my stupid bags and then I come home and then I have to like bring everything in and then I got to put everything away. And I know that sounds ridiculous, but sometimes like, just like all of those multiple steps. So anyways, after last school year, I was really burnt out.

And I really wanted to just take a little mini break and plan to just throw myself back in when I got back from Greece. And then I was like, Nah. I was there for it. So, and I love doing this podcast and I love, like I love it. So I didn't want it to become something that I'm like, oh, I gotta do the podcast. Like I don't ever want it to be like that. So I guess.

The life lesson here is sometimes you need to take a break from the things that typically bring you joy so that they will continue to bring you joy and not become something that is not something that you wanna do. Yeah, that's a good lesson. Thanks. And that's the episode. Just kidding. So if... What are we talking? I don't even know what we're talking about today. This is Marissa has had this...

And remember, I can't read her handwriting, which is amazing, because as a elementary and middle school teacher, I can read almost any handwriting. That makes it sound like it's because my handwriting is shitty, but it's so gorgeous. I think it's because it's such nice cursive writing, like cursive lettering, and it's very rare that I ever see that, especially like attractive cursive lettering. Cursive lettering is very attractive. That's what I want to try in my handwriting.

I'm already. I am not. Failed penmanship. I think that was like one of the only things I liked. Definitely didn't like that.

Michelle & Marissa (04:35.234)

Anyway, what are we talking about today? We're doing a diet deep dive. Woo! So we're diving into, and this, I don't know, maybe somebody has heard of it, maybe they haven't. This was a news to me, and I heard about this diet because randomly I knew a handful of people that were doing it. Just like, I don't know where, I don't know. That's how it always happens. Yeah, and I hadn't heard about it anywhere else. So it's called the chiro-thin diet. Chiro. Yes. Chiro, like, like chiro. chiropractor developed because you know, like nobody loves to get out of their lane like a chiropractor does. So interesting. Yeah. And we'll do, well, at some point we will do an episode on chiropractors. I think that's got to happen. I mean, I do know some chiropractors who are ethical. Yeah. So let's do hashtag not all chiropractors. Like we'll just put that right out there. But yeah, so this was a diet developed by chiropractors.

It's advertised as a quote, doctor supervised diet, but it's not clear to me like how supervised it is, right? So on their website, you can only purchase the chirothin diet kit if you are a chiropractor or like medical doctor. So like you have to register your account, they have to verify that you are in fact a medical professional or a chiropractor.

And then you can buy their kits to resell to your patients with this diet. Okay. Um, the kit comes with the manual, which literally spells out exactly what to do day by day, week by week, because I'm pretty sure chiropractors aren't nutritionists, right? Right. They're not dietitians. They're not. Okay. Nope. They're not. Um, and actually, um, most medical doctors don't have very much in the way of nutritional treatment. Yeah, I didn't think that. Are chiropractors medical doctors? No. What is, what is their lettering? Um.

I believe it's a doctor of chiropractor-y. So, D-O-C, so literally doc. I don't think so. Well, they didn't go to med school for the most part. I'm sure there were probably some who did, but most chiropractors have not gone to med school. And they definitely have not gone to dietician school. So it's kind of questionable how supervised it is, because the manual does spell out pretty much everything for you. And...

Michelle & Marissa (06:59.082)

I mean, there's really nothing to stop somebody from like, oh, I'm a doctor, I'm gonna buy a bunch of these, fucking sell them to my patients, make a ton of money, and they're on their own. So it's kind of, I don't know, I got questions about exactly how supervised it is. And this is a diet that should 100% be supervised by a medical professional, a trained licensed medical professional, preferably with a, well, I don't think any dietician in their right mind would prescribe something like this, to be totally honest. So let me guess, it is under 800 calories a day. It's about, depending on the person, it's eight to a thousand calories a day. That makes me so hungry. I know, right? My stomach just growled. That makes me so hungry. I eat about 800 calories by 11 a.m. every day. Same, same.

So I'd be screwed. I'd be like, oh, well, shit, I just used my whole day. So it's, some of this is gonna seem like tail as old as time. Like a lot of this is very, it's recycled shit that we see with a lot of diets. Like I definitely got echoes of Optavia as I was reviewing this. Because one of the big problems we have with that diet is that it is...

It's oftentimes under 800 calories and it is not medically supervised. No. And it is 110% a starvation diet. You are going to get malnutrition pretty unequivocally if you do that. I actually know somebody who… No, never mind. I'm not going to tell that story. Okay. No lawsuits. No, okay. Never mind. I'll tell you offline. Okay. So there are three phases to the chiro-thin diet.

The first phase is called the loading phase. I don't wanna keep reading my notes, but it's a two day phase. So I don't know if you would call it a phase, but they call it a phase, two days. And your goal is to eat as much as humanly possible in those two days. They're saying a minimum of 5,000 calories each day for two days. And they said- So you're last meal-ing it for two days. Literally, yeah, right? Like diet starts on Monday, last supper, let's just inhale as much as possible. So already we're establishing this really toxic diet habit, right? Of binge restrict. Binge restrict, right? So we're like right off the bat, we're enforcing that binge restrict cycle. They say ideally high fat foods. And you are also supposed to take these drops during the loading phase and during the losing phase. So these drops, you just take seven drops three times a day and there's not a lot of info on them. So they hide- Like from like a tincture? Yeah, like a baby bird. Just like that. Is it supposed to have nutrients in it? Is this supposed to be like- I mean, so like- Like your vitamin drop? No. Like a multivitamin or something. So they hide a lot behind it's a proprietary blend. But what I've been able to summarize is

Priatory blend of amino acids and B12 basically. That's pretty much it. It's not a multivitamin. They do of course have a multivitamin they sell. And that's the one they recommend that you take with this to avoid malnutrition. So you're supposed to take these drops and basically what they advertise these drops as is they're supposed to quote provide nutritional support and they allege that they also will increase your metabolism, right? So when you're eating very low calorie like this, i.e starving yourself.

Your metabolism naturally slows down to keep you alive. And so allegedly taking these drops will help prevent that from happening or like mitigate it. And we'll also supposedly make sure you don't feel hungry. Must be the B12. Yeah. I'm kidding. Bet. I don't want anybody pulling that quote. Yeah, right. Michelle said that B12 will keep you from getting hungry. And everyone's taking B12.

So you're supposed to graze all day long, mostly high fat foods, eat as much as you possibly can. And you're supposed to take these drops. So like my guess is like with these drops, and I wrote this down, my guess, colon, right? So supplementing with- Colon, so like a colon, like your colon. No, like the punctuation. Oh, you made a colon. Yeah, my guess, colon, is like you can supplement with amino acids and that has been shown to potentially help decrease muscle loss during low calorie intake. So maybe their thought is like muscle, the more muscle you have, the higher your metabolism is. So if we give them these amino acid supplements to take, that will help diminish their muscle loss during this period in which we're starving them so they won't lose as much metabolic function. And then basically kind of mitigate starvation mode. happening. So I think that's the rationale behind the drops. But we have this question of what is actually in them and they haven't been independently tested. Like there's no third party testing. There's no peer reviewed studies of these drops and whether or not they're actually effective for this. So who, who is the company? Who, who is the company that creates this diet called chiro thin? They're called chiroceuticals.

Michelle & Marissa (12:21.838)

Okay, Chris. I didn't make that up. That's clever. But do we know who like the, like usually there is like another like Procter & Gamble or like- That I don't know. Somebody else behind that.

Okay, but anyway, sorry. But yeah, so there's the drops and they describe the loading phase as the most enjoyable part of the diet. No shit. Everyone I know who has done this has been like, it's fucking miserable because you're just gorging yourself beyond, like you're full and you're still forcing yourself to eat and you're trying to get as many calories as possible. So you're eating like bacon and you're putting butter on everything and you're eating until you feel sick because you're required to. They were just like, no, the first two days sucked. They were like, I was grateful for the losing phase by day one. I guess I wonder if that's part of it, is to like, be like, see, you don't really like food. Maybe, yeah. This is what you were eating like before. I don't know, something's sick. And there is like, when you go through the manual and you go through their website, it is just packed full of really, really toxic, harmful diet language. Like, it's so much like blaming the individual and like if you are overweight, you are unhealthy, like referencing BMI. Like, you know, being underweight is just as unhealthy as being in the overweight category. And it's like, you are literally ignoring mountains of scientific studies that show that folks that fall in the overweight BMI category in general have better health indicators than people in the normal BMI category and definitely better than folks in the underweight BMI category.

So they're just continuing to rely on junk science, basically, to push this diet. So let's phase one. Okay, so you load. You load, then you lose. Two days. Yep, two days of losing. And then you lose. Then 40 days of losing. I don't know why 40. So- It's biblical. Yeah. You're gonna lose in biblical proportions. 40 days and 40 nights of losing. And on the third day, you'll rise again. On the 41st day.

Michelle & Marissa (14:31.394)

You'll load again. So here's the thing with the losing phase. It does not matter your biological sex. It does not matter your age. It does not matter your body size. You're getting the same plan. Okay. Like I will be getting the same plan as a six foot five, 300 pound man. Like doesn't matter. So you're not allowed to eat breakfast.

So there's fasting involved, no breakfast. You can have liquids at breakfast, but they have to be zero calorie liquids. So they were like, if you do coffee, it has to be black coffee or a zero calorie creamer or Stevia. So no calories, no breakfast. At lunch, you are allowed to have four ounces of their approved lean proteins, right? So like chicken. Just wanna say this, four ounces of meat is like really not a big serving.

I eat more than four ounces of meat every meal. Like I'd say a more average would be six. Yeah, and satisfying, right? Yeah, like four, like if you've ever weighed and measured out four ounces of, like chicken breast or a chicken thigh or whatever, it's like, it's sad. Yeah, it doesn't, I mean, and it might be enough for some people, fair enough. But it's interesting to me that four ounces is always this, like, even if you look at like a package of meat. Oh yeah.

Four ounces. It's always like four ounces is always the standard measure. Yeah. But quite frankly, it's not typically very satisfying. No, I could definitely. I do eat more than that. Yeah. So you can have that, and then you can have four ounces of their approved non-starchy vegetables. So in the manual, there is a whole list of can-haves and can't-haves. Of course. Of course. So I did the math. I mean, it's rough math, but right?

Four ounces of the lean protein is gonna bring you to somewhere around like in the ballpark of like 450 calories ish like give or take. And I rounded a little bit there. And then I used green beans as an example for four ounces of a non starchy vegetable and that's about 36 calories. So for your lunch you're consuming less than 500 calories we can safely say and then it's the same exact thing for dinner. So assuming you are hitting the 500 calorie mark which you probably are not.

Michelle & Marissa (16:56.81)

1000 calories a day max. I'd say like four ounces of like chicken breast is more like 200 calories. Yeah, right. Yep. Yep So there's that and then You can have four ounces of fresh fruit if you want to have fruit It can't be like dried fruit and if you really need to have bread you can have a slice of melba toast

Which I don't know. Like a little Melba toast? No, like the ones like this. Wait, there's real size Melba toast? It's like this long. It's still skinny. Have you ever had a Melba toast? Listeners, have you ever had a frigging Melba toast? Yeah, they're like these tiny little crunchy toasts. Those are the Melba snacks. Yeah, they're good though. Yeah. They're dry. You can only have one of them? You can have one. One Melba toast. And your Melba's gonna be so dry afterwards. So that's the same. So we're looking at somewhere like the thousand calorie range at best. A couple like weird parts that I noticed. One of the things literally, this is a direct quote from the manual during the losing phase, avoid dairy at all costs. No reason why, just avoid dairy at all costs. No reason. No reason given, just at all costs. I'm like, am I gonna die? It's because you just like gorge yourself on fat starting the loading phase. You now have enough fat in your body to last you 40 days. Well, yeah, and that's the goal, right? You don't want it because you want to be burning fat. So they don't want you consuming dietary fat. And you're not allowed to use body lotion. Wait, what? Hey. Like, is it gonna make that much of a difference if you're absorbing lotion through your skin? What?

Yeah, you're not allowed to use lotion. That sounds like a weird chiropractor thing. Oh yeah, that's totally a weird fucking chiropractor thing. Brushing yourself. Yeah, yeah. You can't use lotion. Which I know people that brush themselves, if you like it and you dig it, like good, but like I don't think there's a lot of scientific evidence for that, but that's like a very chiropractor-y type. Oh yeah. Like definitely. And you can only use mineral makeup. Oh, cause it's probably non-toxic, right? I assume. Again, there's no explanation given. And I wonder if the lotion thing is because of the like toxicity that you might like. Maybe. But it's surprising to me they don't like give you like an approved list of. They do, so there are two brands. So that must be what it is. Yeah, like they're like you can use Carmex for chapstick but you can't use any other chapsticks. No Burt's Bees? No, sorry. Not, not Kyra with an approved. So no lotion, mineral makeup only, but like mascara and stuff is fine. Have at it with mascara. Really, really weird.

You do have to weigh yourself every single day. Okay. Which like I got feelings about.

Michelle & Marissa (19:46.282)

I think it should be. So we're not gonna express our feelings here. We're gonna stifle our feelings. We're gonna push down our feelings on that. I'm used to it. And then obviously, because you're not eating anywhere near enough, no or very light exercise during the losing phase. And like, I think we've talked about this before. I think during the Octavia episode, and then I've mentioned there was an MLM that I was briefly and unfortunately involved with that ran a similar program.

If they tell you cannot exercise, that's a huge red flag. Like that right up front tells you you're a starving yourself. Your body is made to move and it needs to move. And so if you were being advised against intentional movement because you're not eating enough, you should be a little nervous at least. Like, so we know that physical activity either through walking and or some sort of high intensity interval training, strength training, has incredible health promoting benefits. So my problem is, is when we are then saying, do this diet to lose weight for your health, and it's like under the guise of health, and I'm like, if you want to lose weight and you want to change your body, like I, no shame in that, right. And I think that it is acceptable for folks to want to do that. Not that anybody needs my acceptance of it. But when we are saying like there is this diet, it's you have to lose weight for your health, but you can't exercise, which we know is so, so important, especially for women, especially for women who are developing and going through the menopause transition because you need to be lifting weight for your bones health, you need to be maintaining and building lean muscle mass so that you don't continuously lose muscle mass as you get older. We lose muscle as we get older. And that's when you get risk for falls. The biggest killer of women, I'm 99.8% positive on this, is heart disease. Yep. Is heart disease. So we're now saying don't do any of these health promoting activities that are actually going to benefit you so you can lose weight for quote unquote health. And I just, this is where I have a problem. This is the problem I have is that like, you wanna lose weight? Great, stop saying that a super restrictive diet that is not promoting health, promoting habits and behaviors is what's healthy. Yeah, and that's where the whole argument of like, well, I'm concerned about your health always falls apart comes to talking to somebody about losing weight. And that's where it's like, no, your fat phobia is showing. And we see this time again, and it's been coming to the forefront a lot with the conversations around Ozempic and Wigoby and all those drugs where all of these horrible side effects are now coming out and this permanent damage being done. And it's like, well, I told you to go on it because I'm concerned about your health. Well, no, if you were concerned about their health, wouldn't you be more concerned about like, you know, these side effects that they could be experiencing

both mentally and physically. I mean, there have been both that have been reported. Or doing, you know, so often folks go to the doctor and it's like, so you need to lose weight. Yeah. But then there's no like additional guidance as to like, let me set you up with a dietician that works with us so they can help guide you on healthy behavior habits with food, with, you know, building those foundational habits. There is no like, let me hook you up with a physical therapist or a personal trainer.

Yeah. You know, like so that you can get some good quality movement in and learn how to move and feel encouraged to move and feel safe to move. And most of these doctors that are lazily prescribing weight loss to people are also not out there advocating for the changes systemically that we need to provide improved access to care. Improved access to safe spaces for movement and improved food access. Yes. Social services. It's just super lazy doctoring. It is, it absolutely is. Like weight loss is not a behavior. Your body weight is not a behavior and weight loss is not a health promoting behavior by definition. It's, if you were really concerned about people's health, you'd be advocating for the systems that have been shown to improve their health. People don't that have to work three jobs to feed their kids don't have the time or the energy to be joining a gym and working out. Why don't we do something about minimum wage? Why don't we do something about how unaffordable childcare is? Why don't we do something about how expensive it is to buy food these days? That is really what is going to impact people's health and wellbeing. Instead of like, let's pay 500 plus dollars on the fucking chiro-thin diet so that you can weight cycle for the rest of your life.

So how long are you supposed, like you can just keep doing the cycle. Wait, did you say there were three phases? There's three phases. Oh, because there's probably some sort of maintenance phase which no one ever fucking gets to. Right, so this, like you kind of forced to because it's 40 days, so then you get maintenance. But they call it the maintenance slash cycling phase. And I don't know about you, but as soon as I see cycling, that's another red flag for me because like that's what it is, diet cycling. You lose, you regain, you lose, you regain. And every time you regain a little bit more because you're doing more and more stuff to your body. So you have your maintenance slash cycling phase, and they insist that after 40 days, you have to go into maintenance. And I think this is because they know how dangerous it is to be eating this low calorie and risking malnutrition for any extended period of time. So one of the FAQs that I found in the handbook was, will you skip your period while on chiro-thin?

And they're like, nope, you absolutely will experience this. No, we'll experience no changes to your menstrual cycle. And I think the only reason why they can say that is because they don't keep you in the losing phase long enough. But if you stayed in it for more than those 40 days, you can bet your ass you would skip your period because your body just would not be able to sustain that process on top of keeping you alive. So during the maintenance and cycling phase, you weigh yourself every single day. And they claim that at three to five weeks, you'll notice that your weight is finally stabilized.

Okay. During this phase, so you do increase your calorie intake to your BMR. That's it. Okay. So for folks that don't know what that is, your basal metabolic rate, it's what your metabolic rate is if you're not moving. Basically if you just- Just like when you're sleeping. Yeah. Like if you're just laying in bed doing nothing, that's your basal metabolic rate. On days where you exercise, you are told you should eat more because obviously you're going to be burning more calories if you're moving around. They actually provide the equation for calculating your own BMR. So again, there's this question of like, how supervised are you actually being by a doctor if they're literally like, this is your BMR calculation. They did ballpark that for most women, you're gonna be looking at 1,100 to 1,400 calories a day, which again is way too frigging low. For most women. And we've talked about like a male toddler eats 1,400 calories a day as a point of view generally. It's all those chicken nugs. Those nuggies. And then for men, we're looking generally between 1500 and 1800, which again is extremely low. And remember like basal metabolic rate, that is, as I said, you're like sleeping, right? You're in bed. So any other activity beyond that, you're burning more calories than that. So cleaning your house, doing the groceries, taking the kids to school walking up and down the stairs to get to your office and back downstairs again, all of that, that's increased calorie burn. It's not taking into account any of your activities of daily living. So that's kind of the part of it. You don't do drops anymore. You're done with the drops. And then your doctor may advise additional rounds of the losing phase. So this is where the cyclin comes in. Like, okay, we got to take you off of it just so you don't die or develop any nutritional deficiencies that can cause damage, and then we'll bring you back. So I do think it's interesting, because most diets, if you think about South Beach diet or the Atkins diet, there's usually a pre-phase, a losing phase, and then some sort of maintenance phase. But the maintenance phase doesn't come until you've hit the goal mark for the amount of weight you wanna lose. And then hold it for a certain amount of time. Yeah, because I can tell you that on any of those diets and I've been on them all, I never made it to the maintenance phase because I've always at some point been, I've always then ended up binging and then saying, fuck it, and looking for the next magical thing. And it's like so many of those diets with their marketing, most of what they're showing you is from that maintenance phase of like, oh, look at how much food you're eating. Look at all this beauty, like, da, da. And it's like, but that's after you get to a certain point. Right, that's not the actual like diet part of it.

Michelle & Marissa (29:08.615)

So it is interesting.

I wonder if that, what is it? The Medifast, that's Octavia. Is that same as like HMR? I don't know what HMR is. Isn't that the medical, isn't that one of the medical ones? I'm gonna have to look, but anyways, I'm pretty sure that that's like another, maybe I don't know. Medi weight loss. Maybe that's what it is. But I'm pretty sure most people who are on that diet, it's under 800 calories, and I'm not sure they cycle you on and off.

I don't know. But that's actually medically supervised. Right, they're doing your blood work and they're also giving you nutritional supplements. Whereas this, that's optional. Here, drink this bone broth. Yeah. So I pulled some quotes that I thought were really interesting. The first is directly from the manual. Why do so many dieters fail? It's simple, dot, dot. Unrealistic goals. And the irony of that, I'm like,

You know what's unrealistic? Thinking you can friggin' stick to this diet for any extended period of time. Thinking that you're gonna have lasting weight loss from a diet that is this restrictive. I mean, even the maintenance phase is an extremely restrictive diet. So, like, if anyone's ever dieted before who's listening, you can only stay in that state of restriction for so long your body is fighting against it. Your mind is fighting against it. We as human beings do not respond well to deprivation. And when we're depriving ourselves to this level, we're depriving our body of basics that it needs. So like, I just thought it was super funny. That's like unrealistic goals. And it's like, everything about this is fucking unrealistic. Yeah, like- Am I wrong? Well, I'm even thinking about, so like kind of swinging back to what we were just talking about, like

building and maintaining lean muscle mass, you need protein to be able to do that. And if you're only eating eight ounces of protein a day, that's how many grams of protein? Hey Siri. Hey math. How many grams of protein are in eight ounces? Oh, it's playing music. Hey Siri. How many grams are in eight ounces?

Of what? 226.8 grams. But how many? Yeah. That's not right. That's what Siri said. Eight ounces is 226.8 grams. There's not, you're not getting, you eat eight ounces of meat and you're getting 226 grams of protein? Just 20 of meat. This isn't right. When was the last time you ate 220 grams of protein in a day, Marissa?

Siri, you lie. No, Marissa, you asked a bad question. Okay, wait. I gotta do the math I did earlier backwards. It's probably about 60. Yeah, you're right. Yes, because how many grams are in an ounce, Siri? No, you don't know how many grams of protein are in an ounce of chicken breast.

You're missing the of protein, how many grams of protein? No! I need to convert ounces to grams first because you gotta do like measurements.

I know how many grams of, wait. We have lost our damn minds. You are a math teacher, fix this. How many grams of protein in eight ounces of meat? Just any meat. About 50, on average an eight ounce steak has around 50 grams of protein. Okay, so that's a good reference point. Do you understand what you were asking wrong?

Michelle & Marissa (33:03.038)

I don't even understand the equation. There is no equation. I think there is. And I think I put X and Y in the wrong spots. God, I'm terrible at math. But like, anyway, I'm so glad this wasn't a test. Fucking fail.

Michelle & Marissa (33:21.994)

You know why you couldn't do this right is because you have 47,438 emails alerted on your phone. Gross. Get rid of all of these alerts. I need a keeper.

Michelle & Marissa (33:41.654)

My life, my mind is chaos. So you're eating 50 grams of protein a day. So you are not probably even maintaining lean muscle mass, which is really bad if you are getting older and we're all getting older. So like, I would like to just like put out like a point of comparison, like for perspective, because people don't think in grams, obviously I don't. But like.

I eat 160 grams of protein a day. I mean, I try to hit that and I usually am more around 130. Yeah, it's hard to hit that much, but like as a point of view, that's how much we're eating. And for it to be giving you, that just shows how little protein that is. I'm five foot four and I eat 160 grams of protein. The recommended basement level is, I believe 80 for most people. Yeah.

So you're below the basement, you're sub-basement.

Michelle & Marissa (34:51.166)

Anyway, that was one funny thing that these people said. They also said that this diet helps dieters break their old bad habits. But there is no part of this program that involves habit coaching whatsoever. It's literally like, follow this, do this, don't do that, eat this, don't eat that. There's no habit coaching whatsoever. And if anything, I feel like this is enforcing really bad habits, like diet cycling.

So I thought that was funny too. I also thought this was really funny. So I found a review of this diet on neum.com. Oh! And neum wrote a negative review. Neum wrote a negative review. So you can imagine how bad this must be if neum is like, no, it's bad news. Yeah. Well, because you know, neum now has a like, not a, you know, a govey. Yeah, yeah. For some, for a company that says they're not a diet. Is it like neum govey?

It is, it's something like that. If you haven't listened to our Michelle Goes Undercover with Noom episode, make sure you go back and listen to that. But the update is that they now have like a special plan to go along with Wigoby, which caveat, one of our biggest.

of the weight loss, any sort of weight loss pill or shot or anything like that is that you're not developing habits that are gonna support you if you happen to stop taking said X, Y, and Z, right? So I suppose we could look at this as a not so evil thing where Noom is now coming in to help people who are Mugovia actually implement better habits for longer, like for real health. Don't look at me like that.

This was a crossover episode. No, I'm just saying, like, so one of our biggest criticisms of that is that they're not, you're in like this diet. We're not, this is worse. Like we're not working on foundational. Yeah, this is worse. Habits. But I'm not, I'm not jumping on the noom train. I'm not jumping on the noom train either. I know. But I get what you're saying. Noom, noom. Okay, I don't want that.

Well, I was going to chew chew. And then I was like, maybe that sounds like I want to jump on the train. So then I tried to be a sad train. Listen, school's back in session. I lose a little bit more brain power every day, every day. Oh God. Um, all right. What's your last funny thing? That was all the funny stuff I had. Great. There was one claim that I forgot to mention.

No. So when you get to the end of the book, they start to like try to explain things and it's not done well. But basically by following their diet, right? Which essentially you're cutting back on carbs, you're eating very low calorie and you're loading up on fat beforehand. So they're alleging that by doing those things and using their drops, it allows your body to more easily perform fatty acid transportation and metabolism so that you can avoid metabolic slowdown and burn more fat for energy. Is that science? No. Okay. Like this, I'm like literally, like if this was the answer, wouldn't every diet be doing this? Yes. Wouldn't everybody be doing that? If we've had the way to figure out how to make your body burn fat specifically, like the fact of the matter is, I mean, burning fat for energy, AKA ketosis is a survival mechanism. It is not something that our body does well or efficiently. And it is a mechanism of like last resort. Like not last resort, that's using protein for energy. But it's not something where, it's not a state we're supposed to be in for long periods of time. And I just don't see how this can be possibly backed by any good science that, oh, we figured out the secret to making it easier for your body to burn fat for anything. Yeah, you know why you're losing weight? Because you're only eating 800 calories a day. That's why you're losing weight. It's not magic. It's not because you're not eating before noon. It's not that you are transporting fatty lipids more efficiently. It's because you're not eating enough. It's literally when your body does not have enough readily available fuel, the next step is to burn its fat store.

It's not like they've unlocked some secret. It's literally your body trying to keep you alive. Yeah. So. So yeah.

Michelle & Marissa (39:29.514)

I don't endorse this diet. No. I also do not endorse Noom. No, we are not on the Noom train. No, no. Noob, noob. So if it does sound like I was a little sympathetic there, you know, I'm always trying to- I was questioning. Listen, I'm always trying to find the like, other side of things. Yeah, you're good at that. I'm just like trying. And especially for, like I do sympathize, or I guess sympathize, like people don't want my pity.

I empathize like what the desire to lose weight and the desire to find the thing that is going to work this time, especially for somebody who lives in a stigmatized body. Yeah, absolutely. And like, I don't want somebody who lives in a larger body and is sick and tired of people treating them like shit because they're in a bigger body and they're finding a way to eliminate that stigma for themselves to write because of the world we live in. Yeah. And I just hope that those folks are able to get the well-rounded support that they deserve to have. Yeah. Instead of just like, here go, I'm pretty sure you just like to shoot yourself in the butt with it, right? Is that how you do a movie? I have never done it. I don't know. Is it in the butt? I don't know.

He's serious. He's serious and in the butt.

I think my dog's face looks so disappointed in us. He's like, aw. Anyways, you're shooting yourself up with, you know, whatever it is that you're supposed to be for helping people with diabetes. Yeah. You know, I like that you said the well-rounded help that they deserve rather than the well-rounded help that they need. Yep. I feel like people use that, oh, the help that you need. It's like, who are you to say what somebody else needs? Yeah. It's really infantilizing. Yeah.

You had that turn of phrase. And I think that like loops back to that like lazy doctor. Yeah. Which, and also doctors don't, I mean, you would think that we also put doctors up on a pedestal, right, that they're supposed to like be the end all, be all of all the things. And they are not necessarily appropriately trained. And unfortunately in the United States anyways, insurance companies run healthcare and.

Insurance companies oftentimes are the ones that are like, you need to take this person's BMI and you need to report it to us so that we can pay you. Yeah. So there is all of these systems that are in place and we're all

being impacted by it. Yeah. So. Yeah, and let's not forget, I mean, BMI became a thing because of life insurance companies. So it all comes back to the insurance companies. I mean, they just jumped on the eugenics idea of ideal body shape. The ideal man thinks eugenics. Yeah. Seems, nevermind. Yeah. Nevermind.

All right. So anyways, we do not encourage you to do the chiro-thin diet. We are excited to be back. We hope you're excited for us to be back. We would love to hear from you if there are any topics that you would love. Like I said earlier, I've made a whole list of content, especially particularly for mini sodes, like really bite-sized little nuggets, dino nuggets.

Me too. They're the best. They definitely taste better than regular nuggets. They do. There's something, maybe they're made of dinos. Maybe they're made of dinos. Maybe that's what it is. Black market dinos. Yeah. But anyways, so if you have questions about fitness, about nutrition, about wellness, things that you would like Marissa and, uh, and, or I to answer either in episodes together or in mini-sodes, please send them to us at strongandsimplepodcast.gmail.com.

Find us on Instagram. You can send us a DM there. So that we can make sure that we're creating the content that we wanna create, but also that is helpful to you, that is entertaining to you, that you wanna listen to and tune into. So, yeah. That's that. Yeah. Thanks for listening, everybody. Thanks for listening, y'all.